Angie's List Message Boards : Angies List Forums

bananajoe:

OMG!!!!  I just submitted a very very negative review about a total smoke and mirrors contractor!  He knows what we think of him and I know what I wrote was concise and truthful but of course his opinion is different.  Do you mean Angies List contacts this guy directly to share my personal opinions???  Please let me know!

 

Yes.  Angies list has just sent this company your report and plastered your name at the top.  One of their excuses is that they did not supply the contractor with your phone number, but of course he has this already because he did a job with you.  Good luck.  You are now the ninth person on this message board to contact Angies List with no meaningful change in their policy.

By the way, Banana  (and I'm not trying to give you a sleepless night, but I think all deserve the truth):

 Read the following link.  This is what can happen to someone if they post a negative  review and their name is passed along to the contractor (who SUED them!!) :

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/12/AR2007031201548.html

 Angies list says they will help out if the company bullies you.  Kasey, will they pay your legal bills also ?

Wow, thank you everybody for all of the information. I am SO GLAD I read this. Unfortunately, I doubt I will ever be willing to post a neg. review on any service or company after reading that article http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/12/AR2007031201548.html

And I thought the subscription rate for angie's list was high! I could never afford to be taken to court! It is too bad a big reason I joined is now not going to be an option for me and I won't be able to warn others about any bad experiences.

I concur with your concerns.  Customer's identity shouldn't be disclosed to contractor unless customer explicitly allowed Angie's list to do otherwise.  When customer posts a bad review, Angie's list can forward to contractor just a review without exposing customer's identity.  Contractor that wants to respond directly to customer  should first inquire Angie's list for customer's consent to be contacted.

 

Exactly. That is a very well thought-out proposal. It would be very ideal and fair to both businesses and customers. It also would protect from customers from, as in the Washington Post's article, the possibility of businesses ruining customer lives with courts and expensive attorneys. It's too much of a risk as their policy stands now.

Dear all, 

We encourage anyone whose report has caused them to have problems with their service company to let us know immediately. We don’t condone bullying or threats, and we’ll step in to help. But I want to be clear that it’s rare that members are bullied or threatened. It's rarer still that legal action is involved -- in our 13 years, it’s happened with only one company.

Many of the companies on the List tell us they use reports as a form of customer satisfaction survey that lets them see where they need to improve their service quality.  

I'll be happy to talk with you individually if you still have concerns about this and, of course, if you find yourselves being harrassed by a service company. You can reach me at cherylr@angieslist.com .

Cheryl,  Its one thing if you forward our reports to the company.  But its crossing the line to put our names at the top knowing that the contractor  has our personal contact info and phone number.  Let me put it this way:  I notice that all the moderators here use their first names.  Why not put your full name on these boards and while you are at it, please give us your home phone numbers, that way we could call you any time with information to make angies list a better service.  If you are bullied or harrassed I'll try to help out. 

Privacy can be a nice thing.

 

There are now 13 people who have expressed dissatisfaction with the "approach" of Angies List to disclosing peoples names with negative reviews, with no MEANINGFUL response. 

Please also note that you may not be aware of every lawsuit filed, but much more importantly the number lawsuit threats that go on as a direct result of your policy.  Please allow me to quote from:

http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/waldron-electric-mcmurray-pa-c33336.html

" When I called the company and informed them that they will not be doing the work, and I will complain to the BBB and place a complaint on Angie's List, he became hostile and threatening my mother with a lawsuit, stating: "If you put me on Angie's list, I will take you to court, I will sue you for everything you have, you'll have nothing when I am done with you, and you will not win". He was bullying my mother so she would not stop the contract, because she would be so afraid. "

 

Hmmmm.

I'm new and I haven't posted anything negative. Now I'm not sure I will. I did notice the warning when I clicked "I'm not fibbing" but I didn't understand the presentation of a report would be "Cheryl says...."  I guess I assumed it would be more of a case of "We have heard from a verified list member ...." and that Angie's List would play a role in settling any confusion over a job gone awry - if any.

If I want to complain and want them to know I am complaining I can call them myself. I may even have a better chance of getting satisfaction since it's quiet and the stakes are low. Once I tell you (which I do for the greater good - so that reports are accurate for other homeowners) the stakes are higher and more dangerous for everyone.

In other words - I wouldn't think you would need to provide member info unless there was a problem (significant question about what really happened, too much emotion or anger) and I had assumed that if there was a problem you would consider yourself involved.

I am not endorsing the way some of the thoughts in this thread have been expressed. But I have to agree you may have a troubled model here (declining reports) if this gets out. In many cities people are allergic to the kind of liability risk you expose your members to and the service will simply die. Which would be a shame.

There are many ways to preserve the value of what you are doing (giving contractors feedback and a chance to answer complaints). You should at least be open to other presentations of member info and maybe even getting more involved in ugly situations in order to preserve the integrity and value of the site.

 

Just my two cents.

 

Cheryl V

 

 

Wow, this is such a shock and its so disappointing.  The whole reason I signed up for this service now goes down the drain.  I had a plumbing company come in and quoted a price to turn a roughed in bathroom to a finished small bath with shower.  They worked part time (supposed to be full time) took three months - was supposed to take 2 weeks.  They never showed up on time if at all.  One couldn't come without the other because they had to ride together, etc.  They walked off the job half way through after having me pay as they went.  I couldn't wait to report them on Angies List to protect others.  Now I'm afraid to because THEY KNOW WHERE I LIVE and this world isn't safe.  Not every company is huge - some are small and if they are exposed for what they are - it certainly could be enough for retaliation.

 Angies list should let the company see the comments BUT should NOT give contact information unless the poster WANTS to be contacted by the company/service provider.  I know I NEVER want to see those guys again - they scare me.

 So, what is this?  Just a way for companies to advertise in an indirect way and get more business.  Because I can't imagine when there would be a time that I would feel comfortable giving a bad report knowing they know where I live.  Angies List got it wrong on this one.   Definitely not what I was hoping for and now that I see how it works, I don't trust the reports because I know that people like me might hesitate posting a negative one.

 My maid has just been arrested on EIGHT felony counts for stealing jewelry from myself and at least 5 other families apparently and police are finding more victims everyday -  They say she has stolen over $100,000 or more worth of items, but will probably plea out and not spend ANY time in jail.  Which means she will be out cleaning fine homes in no time.   I was going to post a negative report  - but no way - she has some not so savory friends and I value my life.  Too bad, I could have saved alot of people alot of misery.

 Oh well, maybe Angies List will make some changes. 

 Cassie

Make that 14.   No wonder there are so few negative or even useful reports in "the list".  There is no way that I can post an honest negative review about a contractor if that contractor is then given my name.  I've never had a truely negative experience where I would be willing to take such a risk.  I would expect such a policy for a free or ad-supported service, but not for something with such a high subscription cost.

 Very disappointed.
 

paxi:

There are now 13 people who have expressed dissatisfaction with the "approach" of Angies List to disclosing peoples names with negative reviews, with no MEANINGFUL response. 

Thanks jh26.  Actually we're up to 16.  But who's counting (certainly not Angies List)!

Hi to all,

I just read all of the "Post Reports at your own risk".. and am trying to understand.  I am a contractor and handyman, just moved (due to marriage), and am interested in Angies list, to let new customers know of my work.  No reports yet.. but I have several new customers (happy ones) now informed of the list.. as it's new to our area. This will be the very first "advertisement" (of any kind) I have used in 4 years of work.  I've only had happy customers, passing on personal reviews for me.  I don't even have or use business cards!  And I stay busy!

But.. as a contractor.. if I do work for someone.. I would certainly already know their phone number, and address, email, and maybe even the code to their garage door opener!!  And if there had been some issue.. it would have already been discussed, and hopefully resolved with them, before it ever were to get here!

So.. if a negative report shows up.. about ME.. I certainly deserve the right to know who submitted it... were they EVEN a real customer??  There IS competition, out there.  There ARE contractors who have learned of my jobs, and attempted to under bid me.  And I've heard stories of contractors hiring people.. JUST to initiate this kind of difficulty.  If this kind of system is ever to work.. the contractors need to be able to know, if it was ACTUALLY a customer, and to be able to reply and defend themselves.  It doesn't have to be a "false report".. (ie.. total fabrication).. but there are always two sides to any situation.  eBay used to have a excellent feedback system for those familiar.. but then they COMPLETELY removed the sellers option to list a buyer as a bad customer!!  And MANY sellers, packed up and left eBay, due to the one-sidedness of that new policy.  I did too.

If I end up with 1 good report here, and 1 bad one.. it won't look good.  If I end up with 100 good reports, and one bad one.. well.. there could be a real issue, or (to be honest), I could have come across a customer.. who has their own opinions of what is right, and I can't make them happy.  What I would recommend to everyone here... is that you talk with, and get to know your contractors and service providers.. as they too will be learning about you, your wants, and your expectations.  Get a CONTRACT.. to specify work to be completed, specific dates, and costs.  And get more than one quote!!!  I've recently exchanged about 20 emails with a new potential customer.. we're getting to know one another... sent them pictures of my recent work, and I do have letters of recommendation too.  As best I can tell.. mine is the high bid.. not the lowest.

And if you insist on NOT leaving any negative reports for fear of retaliation, at least those contractors will have fewer reports, if they are really bad folks.  Word of mouth still works.  BBB still works (somewhat).  And you can file a lawsuit to resolve the situation with a contractor, if necessary.  ONE lawsuit from a contractor over libel??  Walking to your car, and being hit by lightening is a higher risk!

Personally.. and this is just a personal comment, from the other side of the fence.. there appears to be a great deal of anger from many of the posters, on this topic.. as if they are here to simply bad mouth Angies list.  I agree that as a provider, I need to know who leaves negative reports.  I won't argue that some jobs go bad.. especially if you choose the Mob, to remodel your bathroom)...  I won't argue that there are bad contractors, bad auto-service guys, .. and also.. bad customers.  I helped a guy work on a airplane once.. but all he could talk about were the people he had sued!!  I stopped helping him.. I didn't want to be next, by default!  IMHO, angry people are very hard to please.  My 2 cents worth.

handyguyJ

Hello All,

Thanks for the lively discussion on this topic.  Contrary to the opinions of some, we are listening to your concerns and appreciate the discussion.  It lets us here at the List know that you are passionate about our service, just as we are about our members.  The Angie's List model has been in place for over a decade and there are no surprises with regards to our report process.  This is made explicitly clear upon registration and before any report is submitted. 

Also, to counter some misinformation out there, Angie's List does not contact service providers and provide them with all of your contact information. Companies are allowed to see only your name when they read your report, to use as a point of reference. We do not give them any private contact information. We do this to allow companies to respond accurately.  In the event of a negative report, Angie's List will help act as a moderator to assure our members get the service they paid for and deserve.  We are working for our members and at this time the policy we have in place is the one we feel best works for all parties involved, as it helps us maintain the integrity the reporting process. There are plenty of review companies that offer anonymous reporting, but how do we know those reports are valid and not just the rants of someone with an agenda?  Angie's List members are accountable for their reports and that accountability is what makes the List unique and relevant to consumers who want reliable information.

We do not condone bullying ever. If you feel bullied by a service company as a result of a report you submitted, please call our Help Desk at (877) 817-7753.

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts on the List.

 

Handyguy 

 

Thank you for your input.  It is nice to see something outside of a canned response even if it has to come outside of angie's list.  A couple of points (and feel free to correct me if I have my facts mixed up):

 1)  The difference between ebay, BBB and angies list is that Angies list is a paid service on the part of consumers. It is not meant to be a public forum whereby contractors and consumers arbritrate their differences.  You have however hit the nail on the head:  it has essentially morphed into a not so subtle advertising vehicle for contractors.  I have no essential problem with that except I wish Angie would just be more honest in her endeavours. 

 2)  No one is arguing that reports should be completely anonymous.  The report must come from a paid subsriber, with valid email, telephone, and a valid credit card.  There can and should be a method so that the contractor can challenge the validity of the report, but that should not involve mandatory reporting of each name to the contractor, which is NOT made clear at the time that the report is sent as  now verified by 16 people. 

3)  Why do I care so much?  Why don't i just quit the service?  I admit that it justs sticks in my craw when corporations (yes Angies list is now a true corporation)  think that they can just treat the customer like idiots and discard the few dissenters.  To me it is the ultimate in hypocrisy that angie would do so under the guise of consumer protection.